NUOVO BERESFORD CAIMAN MKII

Da kalium Lun Mag 26, 2014 4:51 pm

Nuovo Beresford Caiman MK II in uscita

http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?32624-The-Caiman-MKII-taking-a-bigger-and-better-bite

Da StanleyB Gio Mag 29, 2014 10:50 am

Hi Kalium, thanks for mentioning it.

Da Faber75 Ven Mag 30, 2014 7:02 am

Molto interessante grazie per la segnalazione

Da ghiglie Ven Mag 30, 2014 8:48 am

Ci si potrebbe lanciare nelle disputa dei 24/96 e della necessità del DSD... Ma ho visto che il PCB dell'USB è separato... chissà... :p
Cmq potrebbe essere un oggetto di rispetto, non sono un fanboy Beresford ma il BM mi piace ed è comodissimo. Seguirò il thread su AoS!

Da StanleyB Ven Mag 30, 2014 9:35 am

The question is: do we need DSD? I am not chasing every possible audio format out there. My interest is in getting the best sound quality from existing widely available files. I don't own anything that can play back DSD. And as I have more than 1GB of music, just consider how much it would cost to buy them in DSD if they were available.

As for just 24/96 Max on USB: you cannot go higher than 96kHz on Linux or MAC or pC without special drivers for the different chips. Some of those chips do not have drivers for every type of computer operating system. I also tried all of them and it is so difficult to guarantee that the USB drivers recognize the computer. So it is not so easy for the average user. You need a degree in software to install and get some of these USB drivers to work most of the time.

Da Biagio De Simone Ven Mag 30, 2014 10:49 am

ghiglie ha scritto:Ci si potrebbe lanciare nelle disputa dei 24/96 e della necessità del DSD... Ma ho visto che il PCB dell'USB è separato... chissà... :p
Cmq potrebbe essere un oggetto di rispetto, non sono un fanboy Beresford ma il BM mi piace ed è comodissimo. Seguirò il thread su AoS!

Ciao Ghiglie, non sono intervenuto, e credo di non intervenire per il momento, proprio perchè non si continui a parlare in maniera poco consona di fan boy di Stan Beresford, ma al limite dei prodotti Beresford, di cui vedo che anche tu ti ritieni soddisfatto, e credo che tutto sommato a parte le chiacchiere, è quello che dovrebbe interessarci. Anche io continuerò a seguire su AoS.
Ciao. Smile

Da donluca Ven Mag 30, 2014 12:14 pm

StanleyB ha scritto:The question is: do we need DSD?

Short answer: No, we don't.
Long answer: DSD is a niche format and, as of now, it doesn't have any purpose as the majority of the "DSD DACs" are devices which are unable to natively convert a 2822 Mhz 1-bit signal and therefore they convert to PCM format first and then to analog.
What's more, a DSD DAC needs a certain type of filter in its output stage and this is why most of the commercial products are going the DSD to PCM way: so they can retain their output stage instead of making separate ones (and keep costs down).

My opinion is that even though DSD is an interesting format and it sounds nice to my ear (speaking of SACD content played on a SACD player) it isn't worth the hassle.

As for just 24/96 Max on USB [...]

Again, I personally feel that there's no need of anything higher than 24/96.
Actually, going higher than 96Khz may bring more problems than benefits as quantization noise enters the ultrasonic region and as a consequence we need some kind of filter to cut those down.
The main purpose of going hi-rez is to push quantization noise behind the audible spectrum but going as high as 192 (or higher) just asks for trouble.

I, myself, am pretty comfortable with 24/96 and so should most of music lovers and "audiophiles".

And having a driverless, plug and play USB DAC is always a plus.

One question though: will there be a cheaper version of the Caiman without the Headphone out?
Most of us already have a dedicated Headphone amp or listen through their amplifiers headphone out. I always though about DAC's headphone output as a bit redundant, but that's just me.

I'm curious though as if it will be possible to have the Caiman in two separate versions and how much it will economically impact the production.

By the way, thanks for coming here and your time to answer our questions. Smile

Da Faber75 Ven Mag 30, 2014 12:33 pm

StanleyB ha scritto:Hi Kalium, thanks for mentioning it.

Hi Stan, I see that the new Caiman has a variable line out so if i understand well it can work as a preamp as well.
Do you also offer a remote controlled volume pot? I think it might be helpful.
Thanks.

Da StanleyB Ven Mag 30, 2014 12:41 pm

The headphone circuit is part of the Caiman brand. It wouldn't be a Caiman without the hadphone socket. Maybe one day I can sell a DAC without a headphone socket by just leaving out the headphone socket? It will still cost the same though. The socket is not very expensive so there are no savings to be made.

Yes you can use the DAC as a preamp. That is part of the idea.

There won't be any remote control for the Caiman. Instead it will use the I2C bus on the back to connect to I2C products such as I2C remote controls etc.

Da Mulo Ven Mag 30, 2014 3:35 pm

Con il chip Tenor TE7022 per l' USB, è praticamente necessario comprare a parte un buon cavo USB tra quelli più popolari. Io raccomando il Chord.

Ciao

Da StanleyB Ven Mag 30, 2014 3:48 pm

Mulo ha scritto:Con il chip Tenor TE7022 per l' USB, è praticamente necessario comprare a parte un buon cavo USB tra quelli più popolari. Io raccomando il Chord.

You can afford to use any good USB cable with the Caiman. The power is not from the computer, but from the low noise power supply from the Caiman. There is also a filtering of the ground connection from the PC. So you can save yourself some money in this case.
The TE7022 manufacturer gave me all the information to get the best performance from their chip.

Da Mulo Ven Mag 30, 2014 3:53 pm

StanleyB ha scritto:
Mulo ha scritto:Con il chip Tenor TE7022 per l' USB, è praticamente necessario comprare a parte un buon cavo USB tra quelli più popolari. Io raccomando il Chord.
You can afford to use any good USB cable with the Caiman. The power is not from the computer, but from the low noise power supply from the Caiman. There is also a filtering of the ground connection from the PC. So you can save yourself some money in this case.
The TE7022 manufacturer gave me all the information to get the best performance from their chip.

Yes, surely the power is not coming from the USB, but with my TE7022-based DACs the different USB cables I have make a big difference in quality (each one in its own way). I would just recommend staying far away from anything that's "printer grade".

Da StanleyB Ven Mag 30, 2014 4:15 pm

I actually prefer the printer grade USB cables to the standard ones. The printer versions have a filter. But some people sell ordinary USB cables as printer cables. So they are cheating.

But I am also giong to sell an external 192kHZ USB converter that uses the CM6631A. So there is no need to worry. I shall look after my customers.

Da Mulo Ven Mag 30, 2014 4:20 pm

Regardless of ferrite filters (I have a few basic cables with ferrites), the audio-specific USB cables sound superior (or it's the basic cables that sound bad). Surely this happens with the TE7022. I would pay attention to the quality of the USB cable, rather than add an external USB interface (at probably much higher cost, to boot), but that's just me.

Andrea

Da StanleyB Ven Mag 30, 2014 4:26 pm

It is always a good idea to try out alternative methods. It is the only way to find new improvements. But of course don't spend too much money on it unless you have the money to spend.

Da Mulo Ven Mag 30, 2014 4:29 pm

StanleyB ha scritto:It is always a good idea to try out alternative methods. It is the only way to find new improvements. But of course don't spend too much money on it unless you have the money to spend.

Well said! That's talking wise. Oki

I agree about not spending much money; I guess I would not go over 50€ or so in this case.

Da Mr. Scratch Dom Giu 01, 2014 1:43 am

StanleyB ha scritto:As for just 24/96 Max on USB: you cannot go higher than 96kHz on Linux or MAC or pC without special drivers for the different chips. Some of those chips do not have drivers for every type of computer operating system. I also tried all of them and it is so difficult to guarantee that the USB drivers recognize the computer. So it is not so easy for the average user. You need a degree in software to install and get some of these USB drivers to work most of the time.

Commonly Macs and Linux-based computers don't require any driver with USB Audio Class 2 compliant DACs at all. That said, I don't see the really high resolutions as essential as some people try to make them sound, nowadays. Anyway, to the average customer high resolution music sounds just like rocket science and most of them won't even bother with it.
We need our DACs to sound good at CD quality level first and if it sounds that good up to 96/24 I think that's fair enough.

Da schwantz34 Mar Ott 07, 2014 9:19 am

'acci...come suona bene questo dac...(collegato ad un lettore cd come trasporto...) , rapporto costo/beneficio ottimo! se penso che c'e' gente che al costo di quest'oggetto si compra un cavo usb... Hehe

Da lello64 Mar Ott 07, 2014 9:22 am

schwantz34 ha scritto:'acci...come suona bene questo dac...(collegato ad un lettore cd come trasporto...) , rapporto costo/beneficio ottimo! se penso che c'e' gente che al costo di quest'oggetto si compra un cavo usb...

sei rimasto indietro.... con il prezzo di alcuni cavi usb puoi prenderme dei lotti di quei dac

Da Faber75 Mar Ott 07, 2014 9:24 am

schwantz34 ha scritto:'acci...come suona bene questo dac...(collegato ad un lettore cd come trasporto...) , rapporto costo/beneficio ottimo! se penso che c'e' gente che al costo di quest'oggetto si compra un cavo usb...

quoto, rapporto qualità prezzo stratosferico
io ho il bushmaster, il caiman l'ho provato ma nel mio impianto non riuscivo a tirarne fuori grosse differenze col bushmaster (se non una maggiore precisione in basso) quindi l'ho reso.
l'uscita cuffie è migliorata col caiman

Da cucicu Mar Ott 07, 2014 9:57 am

Appena acquistato! Speriamo sia almeno al livello del rega planet

Da Faber75 Mar Ott 07, 2014 10:22 am

cucicu ha scritto:Appena acquistato! Speriamo sia almeno al livello del rega planet

secondo me lo troverai piu' vivace e dinamico, con piu' dettaglio.

Da Biagio De Simone Mar Ott 07, 2014 10:27 am

schwantz34 ha scritto:'acci...come suona bene questo dac...(collegato ad un lettore cd come trasporto...) , rapporto costo/beneficio ottimo! se penso che c'e' gente che al costo di quest'oggetto si compra un cavo usb...

Sergio ma lo hai Preso? Very Happy

Da beppe61 Mar Ott 07, 2014 10:42 am

schwantz34 ha scritto:'acci...come suona bene questo dac...(collegato ad un lettore cd come trasporto...) , rapporto costo/beneficio ottimo! se penso che c'e' gente che al costo di quest'oggetto si compra un cavo usb...

Sergio, e' una curiosita' personale, quali differenze e/o miglioramenti hai trovato rispetto al DAC interno del tuo cd (che se non ricordo male era un Sony top di gamma)?

Da scontin Mar Ott 07, 2014 10:46 am

beppe61 ha scritto:
schwantz34 ha scritto:'acci...come suona bene questo dac...(collegato ad un lettore cd come trasporto...) , rapporto costo/beneficio ottimo! se penso che c'e' gente che al costo di quest'oggetto si compra un cavo usb...

Sergio, e' una curiosita' personale, quali differenze e/o miglioramenti hai trovato rispetto al DAC interno del tuo cd (che se non ricordo male era un Sony top di gamma)?

Gli deve ancora arrivare ...... Hehe